WHY the music has been changed...

U

UnseenPresence

Guest
Okay, guys and gals:

I have finally found out the reason why the music is being changed on not only Quantum Leap seasons, but on -several- older TV shows, both at Universal and other studios as they release these shows on DVD.

And it's bigger than you probably think. I know it's bigger than what I believed.

I live in Los Angeles, and I'm a director (of theater and tv and film) in real life. One of my good friends works for the most popular payroll company in the entertainment world, and is a CPA. She pays a great deal of attention to what is happening financially in the entertainment biz.

She and I are both going to be at a performance of "I Do, I Do" being done by Scott Bakula on May 20th in Beverly Hills. Her roommate is his dresser for the show (not entirely connected to this topic, but it DOES mean I'm going to get to meet him after the show, apparently.)

So while we were talking about Scott Bakula, up came Enterprise and its ending...which brought up the Quantum Leap telefilm and the almost mystical convergence of the fact that Scott is ending a series the same time Bellisario is and the QL telefilm is (possibly) finally getting off the ground.

She turns out to be a big QL fan (as I am--one of the reasons I became a director), and we talked about the seasons on DVD and I mentioned the music changes.

Long story to get here, but she had the answer:


There is a gigantic battle going on between the music record labels (who are, obviously, the ones who own music used in the background--which is where the problems are coming from) and the television studios/movie studios.

The battle is about the fact that technology has created a format of distribution (namely DVD) that no one was aware of or could have foreseen when the rights for these old shows were negotiated before.

In other words, when Universal negotiated the rights for the music in their episodes of QL, they negotiated for the following:

A) using the music in the first run episode
B) using it in reruns of that episode
C) using it in any syndication of that episode
D) using it in any videos of that episode

Read (D) again. They had the rights for the VIDEOS of the episode. And here is where the battle begins.

For the music labels are saying, "You only have the rights for the VIDEOS. DVD's are different. Pay again or you can't use the music."

The movie studios/tv studios are saying, "NO ONE KNEW ABOUT DVD's at the time of these negotiations...but the idea of paying for video rights IMPLIES paying for 'professional recorded versions for home viewing'...which DVD is just as video is. So our negotiations should cover the DVD's already, for releasing a DVD is the same thing as releasing a Video. It's merely a different style of format, but the same PREMISE."

The labels are refusing to acknowledge it, as they want more money and realize that these older TV shows--created before DVD's came along, of course--are a sudden cash cow.

The studios are refusing to pay again, believing (and in my opinion, correctly) that if the label has already been paid for 'home viewing', the DVD's ought to fall under that banner without the studios having to pay all over again, especially for shows that are old enough to only guarantee a limited revenue return (and face it, most of the old shows being released are only bought by the 'fans' of that show. I love QL...but it's true, regardless).

The labels, in response to the studios, are asking for MORE money than before, including (for many shows) asking for more for the DVD rights than they did for the VIDEO rights...even though the shows are now 10 years older than they were the first time.

The studios, hearing this, are digging in their feet and ONLY paying for music if it's absolutely, 100% crucial to the episode.

And the customer, as is often the case when legal battles begin, is getting the short end of the deal. AND, worse still, according to my friend the battle is long from over.


As much as it may hurt to hear it, the song at the end of MIA is not crucial to the story. It's -thematically- stronger than the weird music they put there. It's -nostalgically- the correct choice, as it's what was there the first time. But it's not the same as the songs that remained the same in the disc-jockey episode. It's not the same as it would be if Sam could suddenly not sing 'Imagine' in the Leap Back (and I have not yet heard anyone say they've cut that scene in Season 3.) The song at the end of MIA is something that Universal felt it could cut. Would I have done differently? Probably. Can I understand the studios refusal to pay -again- for what is essentially a mere technology format difference? You bet.

That's the reason, folks. She showed me memos she's received and emails from CPA's she knows in the music industry to prove it.

Hope that at least explains things more effectively.
 
So what was the problem in the 90s with the video releases? I never read anything as direct as your post, but I always thought there was a problem with the music rights back then, for video. And it was that reason that meant that they could only release selected episodes. Does this mean that if Universal wanted to they could now release the complete series on video in it's original version? If that's true they should do it! Or at least they should have an offer for people who buy the DVDs where they can buy the messed up episodes on video with the original music still in. It obviously wouldn't be as good quality as the DVD episodes but I'd much rather watch and own a complete episode on video than those useless DVD versions. I haven't even watched my MIA DVD all the way through yet because I know I'll just get annoyed with it, there's no point.

Are you sure that one of the rights Universal has is to release them properly on video? If that is true maybe we should all write to them asking for the series to be brought out on video. Or at the least, those epiosdes that are getting changed in the DVD releases.

If Universal explains it on the DVD box, like you did in your post, then people would know it was the music companies and not Universal itself that was being greedy. Sure, a lot of people wouldn't buy it because think Universal is being chaep, but wouldn't it be worth it for all the people who would want the complete versions? Surely there would be enough wanting it for Universal to do it.
 
Quite right.
I'd much rather have an original set of DVD's naturally - better quality and they don't take up as much space.
Yet I would gladly buy a complete set of QL videos if they definitely had all the original music, rather than the bastardised DVD's as they are at present.
 
I cannot say what happened in the 90's with any certainty, as I wasn't here to find out back then. I myself always assumed it was simply Universal only releasing some episodes because they felt there was no market (Universal has been remarkably un-supportive of most of their shows during their on-air seasons...and worse, still, after the show is canceled).

Given what I've seen, yes, it looks like Universal -could- release videos with the original music.
 
Does this mean that if Universal wanted to they could now release the complete series on video in it's original version? If that's true they should do it!

That will never happen. VHS is a dying format in my opinion. I think DVD technology will eventually phase it out completely and these companies would think that there's no money to be made there. It's a huge leap back (no pun intended) and wouldn't be very smart from their point of view. Not to mention the fact that VHS does not have the durability of a DVD.

In response to the music issue, that sounds about right. But this seems to suggest that Universal isn't the bad guy here and that the record labels are. The truth of the matter is, they're both wrong. A billion dollar company like Universal is downright refusing to pay money to acquire songs. While the reason may be understandable, they are making the decision because they have only THEIR best interests in mind and not the FANS'.

The record company, of course, is acting ridiculous about it (we all know that these companies are both greedy and cheap at the same time), but so is Universal. It's like two stubborn children in an argument refusing to give in to one another and wreaking havoc in the process without realizing or caring. (This same childish mentality is why war exists and lasts.) Universal really needs to get its priorities straight. It seems like the top executives there are both trying to make a logical decision and save their dignity at the same time. But they don't seem to realize that they are alienating fans of their TV shows and movies in the process which is worse. Retail stores go above and beyond to help the customer all the time, right? Well, this isn't what's happening here. Universal may not care about its shows (and to tell you the truth, who cares if they care or not as long as the DVDs are done justice), but it needs to make the fact that the fans care a priority.

We knew music had been removed. We put two and two together and realized that only songs sung by the characters remained. We concluded that it was about money (why else?). And so, if this is true, our suspicions were correct but with an added twist. Shame on the record companies for creating this problem in the first place (as they do a good job of destroying most music on the radio today already), and shame on Universal for not paying up.

Is the money coming out of these executives' pockets personally?! No! It's coming out of a billion dollar company that has no problem affording the costs (whether absurd or not) and they STILL choose not to pay. I can't begin to tell you how disgusted I am with all of this.
 
NOTE:

I'm not suggesting that Universal is without blame here. As I said in my first post, if -I- were the head of Universal, I'd have been trying to figure out a way to get all of the music on the DVD's.

Do I think the -larger- problem is with the music labels in this particular issue? Yeah, I do. I think they are MORE to blame than Universal (or any of the other studios, which are running into the same issues).

What needs to be remembered here is that -every- negotiation over rights of music in entertainment is a hotly contested one. If you own a studio and you give in and say, "Fine, we'll pay again," then you've opened the other studios to having a much harder time if they wish to fight it. So the studios get pressured by each other.

On the flip side, if you're Warner Bros. Music and you say, "Fine, we won't make you pay again," then you've opened all the other labels up to having a nightmare time if they want to stand firm. So THEY get pressured by each other.

It's like the constant battles between the various unions and the studios that happen every time renegotiation starts. Is it ugly? You bet. More common than you'd imagine, however--and not just in the entertainment industry.

From what I've seen at this moment in time, I think the labels are MORE wrong here than the studios. Which is not to say, once more, that the studios are blameless...just, I guess, less to blame. :)
 
The record lables are gonna be greedy right now...They have been doing everything they can to make up for losses from copying and illegal downloading...To prove my point, go to a store and see how many movies on video are cheaper than the soundtrack on cd...Until the record lable makes up their losses, they are gonna charge an arm and a leg for fees...Another problem is in the late 90's, no one realized how major DVD sales would become...A lot of lables thought it would not last like the mini-disc. For example, the reason why Back to the Future took forever was that Universal decided to sell overseas rights to Sony on their titles for a 4 year period...During that time if Universal distributed their titles to the overseas markets, Sony would get the money..So Universal had to wait to get the rights back after the 4 years (kinda like some country getting a canal back)...In the 90's, no one would have given tv shows on dvd a second glance...A few years ago, it exploded on the market and now everyone wants a piece of the cash cow...
 
This may seem like a dumb question, but why would the record labels/studios care whether or not they make future decisions for other companies difficult? Aren't they all out for themselves? Or are they afraid that making a decision like that will come back to haunt them?

And yes, the record labels have taken a big hit over the years (I never had sympathy for them), but the last I heard, things were looking up for them. This is pretty much a result of legal downloading programs such as iTunes, where you download songs for 99 cents, etc. Also, keep in mind that illegal downloading may not have been solely responsible for the decline in record sales.

The DVD market has exploded in recent years, where now you may have customers putting their money into DVDs as opposed to CDs (like myself), and other forms of technology are becoming more popular as well. Point being: The average consumer nowadays is not as interested in CDs as they used to be. Illegal downloading programs are basically a good scapegoat for the record companies to point the finger at...well, because they're considered illegal.

Returning back to the music issue: Who do I think is more to blame? I suppose the record companies are as well for creating this problem in the first place. But it's not about who's more to blame. We have a problem, and it needs to be fixed NOW. It just baffles me that the CEOs of these industries can do the impossible when it comes to making money, but apparently they're incapable of making an agreement. This sounds like it will end up a court matter (if it isn't already). If that's what it takes, so be it. Whatever the result, I just hope it's for the fans' benefit for a change. And by the way, thanks for the information and welcome to the board, UnseenPresence.
 
I do believe I mentined this to QL nut several months back I'm not sure if you remember about the music changes, yes its funny that they could release it on VHS with the music but they didn't buy the rights for DVD, thats also why you'll see it on tv with with music as I mentioned before, in my oppinion its still the same but record lables want more money, damm them all to hell.
 
"Video"

Excuse me, but where does it say "Cassette" or "tape" up there? "Video" seems like a very generic word to me, which you can easily add the word "disc" to. In fact, if you go to www.dictionary.com, and look up the word DVD, you get this:
dvd

n : a digital videodisc; a recording (as of a movie) on an optical disk that can be played on a computer or a television set [syn: videodisk, videodisc, DVD]

Gee, look at that. A "Video". Why the hell didn't the producers realize this, and just fight? The music industry doesn't have a leg to stand on here as far as I'm concerned.
 
Re: "Video"

agree wholeheartedly jbluez....and welcome. :wavey

Would love to see the legalese wording.....
 
Re: "Video"

Yes your right, they should have fought for it because they would have probably won, they just assume that they were right in the format argument.
 
> Re: "Video"

Universal seems to care, but not in the way they should. They seem to care only that they aren't getting their money's worth in the rights they had originally paid for. They don't seem to care that fans are pissed off or that the quality of their shows has been tarnished. If they didn't care much about their shows all this time, I don't think they care too much now, aside from the fact that they want a piece of the DVD cash cow.

It doesn't seem like the company wants to go through the trouble of taking this matter to court (unless they already have and I'm not aware of it) and spending money on legal fees. Instead, they'll go into a back-and-forth battle and continue to butcher their shows in the process because, hey, who cares, right? At least this is the way I see this situation. Since neither company wants to speak up about it, all we can do is speculate.
 
>As much as it may hurt to hear it, the song at the end of MIA is not crucial to the story.

I could NOT disagree with you more!
You are totally wrong. That song is something EVERY true QL fan remembers, because it is linked to the final episode, and it has an extreme emotional attachment in both episodes.

Why do you think M.I.A. (from USA or SCI-FI) has been bootlegged on eBay, posted continuosly in the scifi multimedia newsgroup, bit torrent, and swapped between friends?

You are dead wrong in my book pal.
 
I think Unseen Presence was trying to imply that from a dialogue standpoint, Universal did not deem "Georgia" as important enough to warrant making sure it remained, since none of the characters directly mentioned that song during that scene (even though Al specifically asked Sam if he got the record of "Georgia" earlier in the episode, but I digress). Yes, we all consider that a lame excuse, but they looked at it differently. Unless a character is directly singing along to the song or mentioning the song immediately before it plays (like in the DJ episode), Universal feels that the song can be omitted to save money. I agree, it is not right and this issue should be fought with the music companies, if it has not already. IF Universal has been trying to fight this, then the least they could have done was to explain the situation to us. Most of us, I assume, would have tried understanding if they had placed blame where it belonged. This is what I am most annoyed at... that Universal does not respect its consumers enough to be truthful; or that they think we are too stupid to understand the legalities of the industry. But I shall comment more on this another time...

As for the post, it is perfectly okay to disagree, just try to keep cool about it, okay? Using the words, "You are dead wrong in my book, pal" sounds a bit like lashing out. He was just informing us about what he heard. Don't kill the messenger. This is not a "lecture" or warning or anything like that... just relaying to you how a comment like that can be misconstrued, that is all. It tends to bring out the Dark Side in some people... :evil

And, oh yes... welcome to the board!
 
"You are totally wrong. That song is something EVERY true QL fan remembers, because it is linked to the final episode, and it has an extreme emotional attachment in both episodes."

I didin't even notice the song change until it was posted here. And I'm the biggest QL fan I know.

I would have noticed something amiss during MI but not during MIA.
 
Maybe there's hope after all!!! Just got an idea!
If they play their cards right and care about the fans maybe sometime soon they'll RErelease season 2 with music, and upon buying it again if you present them season 2 without they'll give you half off. Thats what I'd do.
 
Didn't mean to sound harsh. But I think you can see how this has affected some loyal fans of QL.

I would GLADLY have paid something like $69.95 for a complete unbutchered set.

I just think it's Universal in general. It is a shame that THEY released all of the great sci-fi TV shows over the past 30 years. I am talking about six mil, bionic woman, incredible hulk, QL, and on and on. They care only about profit, not fans.

Want a good example of how a DVD set should be released? Talk to anyone (like me) who is a big fan of Freaks & Geeks.
All music was left in for all 17 episodes, and the set cost over $50 because of the licensing...and i GLADLY paid it.
Because without the music, it would have sucked.

I don't think people realize how important music is to a good TV show. Look at Miami Vice (yet another Universal job)...at least they released season 1 intact.
 
If the movie studios feel so strongly that "video" is inclusive of the DVD format, why don't they just release the DVDs intact and then make their case in court?
 
QLNut said:
Simple. Because they don't want to take a chance and get sued for more money than they spent.
Then their case isn't as strong as they're making it out to be.
 
'They had the rights for the VIDEOS of the episode. And here is where the battle begins.

For the music labels are saying, "You only have the rights for the VIDEOS. DVD's are different. Pay again or you can't use the music."

The movie studios/tv studios are saying, "NO ONE KNEW ABOUT DVD's at the time of these negotiations...but the idea of paying for video rights IMPLIES paying for 'professional recorded versions for home viewing'...which DVD is just as video is. So our negotiations should cover the DVD's already, for releasing a DVD is the same thing as releasing a Video. It's merely a different style of format, but the same PREMISE."'

Why didn't the stupid studios just hammer out a deal when it came to the table? Sounds like they just started a war nobody wins with now.

Maybe the studios should just use the extra DVD profits they got from screwing over the WGA to pay for the damn songs?!

Both sides should realise that fights like this will just drive up bootlegging, which BOTH are fighting against as it is!

As far as QL goes, this is one show that REALLY needed to keep it's music. The music was just as much a character as Sam and Al. It set the mood and tone of the Leaps, and convinced the viewer that Sam was actually in the time he had leaped into.

Crappy synth garbage actually calls so much attention to itself that when it plays, I can't even pay attention to the dialogue becuase I am so repulsed.

I had taped and watched every episode as it aired so many times the tapes wore out... The replacement music is such a distraction to me that I would rather they had just deleted the music without any replacement audio whatsoever.

You know, the Star Trek series seasons cost almost 3 times as much as most other series seasons-- and I would never pay that much for any Star Trek.... I would have gladly paid that much for a season of QL had they left every single piece of music intact.
 
Actually, it's Digital Versatile Disc.
But the end result is the same, the discs store digital videos.

The music industry is just plain greedy, selfish and arrogant.
 
You know, I hate to say it, but prior to Napster, I bet there wouldn't have been so much trouble getting the rights to music for DVDs. Without Napster and Kazaa and all the other (which is fine for out of print or hard to find music, IMO, but is just "wrong" for new stuff that you can easily buy on CD), the music industry wouldn't feel the need to BE so greedy. Not saying they're right, mind, but their greediness really started coming out after the whole Napster thing.
 
And to think, the record industry is rebounding now thanks to legal downloading programs like iTunes. When's the point where they say, "OK, we're making enough money again"? How much is enough? The record companies will never get to this point and will always be greedy.

Anyway, an outside company (or Don himself) needs to buy this show from Universal. The problem here is that Universal doesn't want to have to pay again. Anyone else could make a new deal from scratch and pay for the music the first and only time. I think that's our only hope. I don't see the recording industry and these movie studios reconciling any time soon.
 
The music industry was never devistated by peer-to-peer downloading. Sure, it made them get a smaller profit than what they were use to, but it didn't bankrupt them in any way. They were just blowing it way out of proportion. I support bands. I don't support the greedy producers that think only they should get paid for the first million CD's their artist sells. That's why so many bands have to tour 200 shows a year, just to make some money because they don't get it from the record sales. Anyways, enough of that rant. The RIAA sucks. They don't support artists. They support producers and the like. The RIAA is trying to make it sound like you're stealing from the artists and that they're going broke because Joe Schmoe down the street download a couple of songs. He's not stealing from the artist. He's stealing from the record company, but it's not much. The company still makes millions. They're just greedy. And as long as they're greedy, they're going to blame Napster, Kazaa, etc. for lower profits. Maybe it's because the CD's are so expensive, especially when there are only 2 or 3 good songs out of 10+. <end rant>
 
What cracks me up is the way of thinking by the RIAA.
Why the hell would someone pirate a song that is released on a DVD soundtrack to a TV show where people are talking over them?
I *know* that their gripe is that DVD, unlike video, is digital, and therefore "better", so the audio (songs) should garner higher costs because it can easily be reproduced without any loss in quality. I would agree if the songs had no voice-overs/action from the TV show, but this is rediculous.

The end result is only one thing, the RIAA is a fat pig that only wishes one thing...to get fatter! They could care less about us, they never have. It really is such a shame.